From: "Mike NotSpecified" Subject: [Consim-l] Turning Point Stalingrad Mircea mentioned this as one of the games he'd like to see discussed on this list and it inspired me to pull it out and give it a try. I've started by reading the designers notes etc. in some back issues of The General and laying out the board with the historical set-up. At that point I was pretty impressed and enthusastic about the game. Then I read the rules, which seemed pretty straight forward and I was still enthusastic. Today I walked through the series replay in The General, and came away much less enthusastic about really learning this game. Several problems I'm having: 1) Asthetics. The map is gorgeous and I love it. The combat units are pretty standard, though I dislike the mix of styles. NATO symbol for infantry, icons for armour, abbreviations for most other types (eg ENG). But the part that annoys me is the clutter. Each area gets a control marker. Why not say all areas are Russian unless marked German, or vice versa? And when units are distrupted they could be disrupted 2 to 4 days, which is indicated by piling brightly colored geometric shaped counters on them to indicate the day they become freash again. So a typical Russian area has a control marker, a rubble marker, some freash units (red), some spent units (white) and maybe a blue hexagon stack, a pink triangle stack and a orange circle stack. Yuck! 2) The combat resoltution system takes the largest unit on each side, adds 1 for each additional unit, plus more additions for terrain, artillery, air, etc., then adds a die roll to each side, then combines the two totals and the difference is the casualties. I don't know how accurate that all is, but it bugs me because lots of the smaller units have nothing to do all game but follow around behind the big units adding their +1 to the total. It does not feel right. Part of why it does not feel right is that you end up forming "killer stacks". The big unit and all his little buddies. But that makes the little buddies really nothing more than components of the bigger parent organization. So why bother? Why not reduce the number of units on the board and just go with with a unit for the parent organization. Granted, sometimes you're going to want to split the Brigade up into battilions, but that's what subsitute or breakdown counters are for. This feels like you're hauling around the subsitutes all game for no real advatage, and at considerable extra overhead. 3) The rules are difficult upon second reading. Most things are explained only once, and not always where you think it would be. I suspect they are quite complete, but you really have to get your mind wrapped around the whole body before you can play. No "read the section when you get to it". 4) Turn sequence. I know this is an elegant turn sequence with variable length day/night. I know I will like it, because I've seen it before in Storm over Arnhem. But as preented in the rules it says little more than that the players alternate taking their impulses. Since literally everything can happen in an impulse, this isn't much help in learning the game. Equivilant to just saying "it's your turn". 5) Combat does not feel like Stalingrad to me. I wheel up my big stack, we both do all the accounting and one of us retreats/killls enough units to satisfy the results, then we both disrupt everybody who was involved to varying degrees. Very much factor counting and accouting, not so much desperate fighting and hanging on by fingernails. 6)Movement is really hard to visualize. Price paid for entering an area varies on proximity and status of the enemy. I'm sure I'll "get it" eventually, but right now I have no real sense for how far units can move. 7) The Series replay is full of mistakes. The illustrations show units that did not move at different locations and the combat accounting is not always accurate. (I have poured over the rules trying to come up with the same numbers, it's just not right). Overall I'm not sure I'm willing to work this hard for this game. Somebody encourage me to stick with it? _______________________________________________ Consim-l mailing list Consim-l@mailman.halisp.net http://mailman.halisp.net/mailman/listinfo/consim-l