Subject: Fw: Normandy 44 first impressions Henri H. Arsenault ... I usually don't buy D-Day games (or rather regret buying them) because let's face it, the Normandy battles until the Cobra breakout were slugfests with little room for maneuver. I bought the game anyway mainly to encourage the series to continue, because this is a great system. I have tried only a few scenarios so far, and yes, it does seem like the games are mainly slugfests, which is quite a change from Smolensk 41, where there was a lot of room for maneuver. Fortunately there are a number of scenarios that take place a fes days after the invasion, such as Operation Epsom, Villers-Bocage and a few others. There is a 750-move campaign with a larger map that no one is expected to play, for the benefit of those who want to make their own scenarios. Smaller campaigns are up to 270 moves. I always wondered where the Canadian North Shore Regiment had landed, since my uncle was in it and was shot in the buttock shortly after the invasion (don't ask); I found the regiment in a few scenarios, they were a part of the 8th Brigade of the 3rd Canadian Infantry Division. I don't know how well the game models the incredible stupidity of some of the Allied leadership in Normandy, as described in Reynolds' Steel Inferno, which describes mainly the battles involving the 1st SS Panzer Corps. I wonder if the incredibly stupid Black Watch carge in the open is modeled in the game, where most of this excellent regiment were mowed down by the Germans as they continued to advance in the open against German machineguns. I didn't notice any scenario involving the Mortain German counter-attack, and the game doesn't seem to have scenarios that go as late as operation Cobra, St Lo and the Falaise pocket, where the slugfest turned into same kind of maneuver battle as Patton tried to exploit the breakthrough though hampered by severe supply problems. Ther are multiple version of the same scenarios, some covering different lengths of time, and some presumably covering what-if situations, although this is not explained clearly. Do the scenarios saying that Rommel got his way and that the two German Panzer divisions were set up for an immediate counterattack correspond to divisions that Hitler delayed for three days? Or is this just a re-depoyment of divisions that were already available? I get the impression that HPS is saving the later Normandy battles for a new game, possibly involving Operation Cobra and the following weeks, and possibly a third involving battles for the Saar and maybe even Market Garden, the game system being particularly well-suited for the latter. Henri Subject: Fw: More on Normandy 44 Henri H. Arsenault wrote in message ... As I said in yesterday's message, I let the computer play itself overnight in scenario 16b, where the 12th SSPanzers and the Panzer Lear divisions are initially on the map behind Bayeux, instead of being kept in reserve. This allows the Germans to launch an immediate counter-attack. After some 18 moves (less than two days), it doesn't look too good for the Allies: the 12th SS has reached the coast between Omaha Beach and Gold Beach, probably striking right between the US and British forces following the old adage that the juncture between two enemy forces is usually the weakest point. Some of their units are hammering away at the US beach units, some of which are in relatively small pockets. On their left, Panzer Lear with the other have pushed the US 82nd and 101st Airbornes back some distance, and although for the moment the danger is not too great, those divisions and the Utah Beach landings are in a huge pocket reaching some five miles from Carentan. Far to the East, the British paratroopers have been pushed back some distance by the 21st Panzers and the other German forces in the area. Everywhere the Allied forces are very tired, many are out of supplies, disrupted or out of command, and although some of the Germans are also ragged around the edges and low on supplies, some including most of the armor of the 21st Panzers, are as fresh as roses. And the Allies have taken over 25,000 casualties whereas the Germans so far have taken only 8000. After less than two days of fighting, both sides still have considerable forces not yet on the map, and the Allies have not yet lost any of their landing beaches, although it is not clear how long they can hold out against a determined battering from the Germans. At least they can count on the Canadians to fight to the last man (assuming that they replace Keller as soon as possible as commander of the 3rd Division...). It looks to me like the third day will be a critical juncture of the battle, where the Allies may get a second breath as the Germans wear themselves thin or as the Allied defenses disintegrate. The next critical juncture will be in a couple of days when strong German reinforcements are due to arrive, including among others the 17th Panzer Division and the 77th Infantry Division. At this time, the victory conditions indicate a decisive German victory, and whereas the Allied ship seems to be floundering, the Germans seem to have the wind in their backs. It doesn't look good for the Allies, but if they can manage to land most of their forces on the beach , maybe they can still turn the tide (Hey, the Canadian Black Watch hasn't landed yet, and when they start to play those bagpipes, every German within five miles will head for the hills...). I'm sure this is not what Churchill intended when he said "We shall fight on the beaches...". (I think I hear an Allied officer yell "Every man for himself!..."). On the other hand, there is probably a point beyond which the Allies should call off the invasion as a failure. I don't know if this is programmed into the game. I'll check out how it is going when I go home for lunch. henri Subject: Fw: Normandy 44: still more Henri H. Arsenault wrote in message ... Here is the final result on my computer vs computer game of scenario #16b, where the 12th SS and Panzer Lehr are on the map at the start. The scenariois 70 moves, and required a few overnight sessions. Early on I had the impression that the Germans were going to throw the Allies back into the water, but it didn't turn out that way, although the Germans did reach the coast between the British and the US landings. The Germans failed in the sense that the Allies succeeded in landing all of their forces except a few that did not manage to arrive due to 20% arrival probabilities. On the left, the Omaha bridgehead held, and the Americans even managed to expand their bridgehead somewhat. The Utah Beach bridgehead had not much trouble linking up with the paratroopers, and when the scenario ended, their bridgehead extended roughly in a circle from the bridgehead all the way to Carentan, which was still in German hands at the end. The Americans didn't manage to break through to the West Coast of the Cotentin peninsula, but they were never in any serious danger. Although as I said the Germans made it to the coast in the center, they were inefficient in stopping the British, led by the Canadians to ram their way past the Bayeux-Caen highway almost all the way to Villers Bocage. The Canadians, with a British armored division right behind them followed by the rest of the Commonwealth army could probably have reached the bottom of the map, had they not diverted about half of their force to hit Caen from the West while a main British force pounded it from the North. Caen was defended essentially by the 21st Panzers, who were rather slow in getting into action. The 12th SS were badly mauled on the British right flank, while Panzer Lehr dallied behind the Germans trying to ram through to Omaha Beach. As a result, the Canadian thrust South was hampered mainly by hapless German security troops. Despite this rather somewhat unimpressive performance (I could be wrong, but it is my impression that a human could do much better than the German PO reaching the coast between the US and Commonwealth without capturiong the landing beaches looks useless to me), the Allies suffered a decisive defeat due to the number of victory points, but it seems to me that this is a German defeat, since they utterly failed to prevent the Allies from landing all their forces, and at the end, the British and Canadians have a half-dozen divisions that they can thrust unopposed to the South while their main force fights for Caen, which should be a tough fight as it was historically. Maybe I should try this again with a still longer scenario (maybe full campaign), to see what the Germans can bring to bear to avoid an Allied breakthrough (Canadians in BVerlin by Christmas?). True, the 2nd Panzers' armor is not yet on the map, and tough German units that participated in the Normandy battle like the 2nd, 9th and 10th Panzers have not yet arrived. The question is whether the Allied attrition rate is fatal or not. I still don't know if a faster reaction by the Germans against the invasion could have caused it to fail utterly. Henri