John Kollar - 08:43pm Aug 4, 2002 PST (#220 of 244) Ian- We have a whole bunch of new questions. First, we restarted the game because we strayed so far from the rules, so no French invasion of Edinbrugh, yet... :-) First, an old question, to revisit the siege. In the answer, you say that rule 11.213 is correct and that you need 1-1 Modified odds, but the rule actually says: 11.213 "the besieger must have the same number of companies as the printed value of the besieged force or the siege is lifted". The rule does not say modified. I have an idea what is intended, so tell me if my assumption is correct: To start or maintain a siege, one needs a minimum of 1-1 odds of unmodified strength. (Otherwise, if the fort had 1 company, a minimum of 7 companies would be needed to maintain the siege, which sounds a little excessive (2/9, 3/11) plus values would have to be recalculated based on the weather) To try to resolve the siege, a minimum of 1-1 odds, modified, is needed, plus a roll on the initiative of the commanding general. To resolve the siege normally, a minimum of 5-1 odds, modified, is needed. -John -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- John Kollar - 09:11pm Aug 4, 2002 PST (#221 of 244) Ian- Now onto some of the new questions: A1) Is there a way to know what contingent leaders are a part of? For example, is BG Lord Home part of the Scottish Militia? etc... A2) Just a clarification: CWs need to be stacked with a unit, but leaders can move by themselves? A3)The orders and CP chart (7.17) does not list any initiative rolls possible, so is initiative in addition to the orders & cp list? A4)Two Jacobite leaders start the game in France, do they need a CW order from Charles to get on a boat to come to Scotland. They can't activate themselves? 18.22 refers to CW needed activation, table 7.17 does not list naval activation. A5)Why do the Jacobites have a +2 modifier for the Channel sea zone, but no modifier on the Naval Interception Table (18.25). A6)Naval Interception Table (18.25) under modifiers for the Government only, lists two modifiers, +1 for West England and -1 for West England. Which one if correct. A7)A 'why' question, why does sea transfer take so long? It seems to take a month to travel from Flemich ports to London. A8)In the transit table, what does "FPts" stand for? Also, when returning troops to Flanders, what zone do you use to roll on for the final move. More generally, how do you actually DO a naval transit. Rule 18.24 makes no sense with the current Transit Table (18.24) nor with the transfer example in 18.28. Also, how do you land the unit? For example, if my units start the turn in the East Scotland zone, do they land in Aberdeen automatically? If not, what column do I roll on? A9)Do commanders need to re-assigned every turn, or once assigned do they stay assigned? Well, we restarted, and got a few turns in, progressing very differently this time, Georgie is working his way to England, currently at sea. Orders sent to the two guys in France, they get to start moving in a turn or two, I was lucky with my mustering rolls, and got several units at the beginning. Progressing along... -John -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Adam Starkweather - 07:23am Aug 5, 2002 PST (#222 of 244) On the drawing board - It Never Snows in September. On the table - Highway to the Kremlin and PBEMing Thunder at the Crossroads. A few followups as well, Just to make sure we are doing it right; the Government player has only one place to recruit until activation - Edinburough. He may only recruit English Regulars and must roll a "0" (0-1, minus 1 for Summer) to get any? That is the only mustering he is allowed at start. If George sails to England on turn one there is no way he will have his guards with him as release is after naval move. And just to make sure (since the rules state clearly otherwise), George only gets his escort if they are released via a Flanders release roll, it is not automatic. In addition, if they are released, there is a 1 VP penalty every month for early release of any units of the Calais force? The Government player must pay the same VP penalty for George's escort as they would for release of the army to England (minus then per 20 companies penalty). To follow up on John's naval move question; the rules state that interception is checked for the zone the naval move starts in, not the zone it states it is going to. The example of play indicates that it is the zone going to that is checked. The "FPorts" column, if it means "Flemish Ports" (as stated in the rules but not on the map) would also indicate this as now all sea zones one could be going to would be listed in the charts. If this is the case, then the final move from zone to port would be free of interception. Is this correct? Lastly, I suspect that an easy win by the Government player is possible but permanently removing 60 companies (assuming a 5-5 VP at the time - more companies could leave if need be) from the Calais garrision during the last reinforcement phase of the end of August turn as this would give a VP differential of 3 to the Government? Cheap if true - what amI missing if not true? Adam -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Adam Starkweather - 07:07am Aug 6, 2002 PST (#223 of 244) On the drawing board - It Never Snows in September. On the table - Highway to the Kremlin and PBEMing Thunder at the Crossroads. Oops - forgot one last thing... On the Naval Interception Table (18.25); under the Government only modifiers - -1 West England Zone +1 West England Zone I assume at least one of these is incorrect on the chart. Ian? ian weir - 04:47pm Aug 6, 2002 PST (#224 of 244) Mad is he? Then I hope he will bite some of my other generals - King George II on James Wolfe Answering John's questions first: 1) check the updated errata: Reay should be the only guy not assigned units either by stacking with them or entering with them (eg Home enters stacked with Scots Militia). 2) 7.12 point #4 12 MPs each. 3) 7.18 gives initiative situations. Point #1 says appoint self commander; if successful he would then be eligible to spend CPs. 4) 18.22 is correct as it reads. In he notes to table 7.17 it specifies the ADM move as applying to naval transfers. Naval transfers are a form of admin movement. As a historical note, the diplomatic post between Paris and London took 1 week one-way – if the weather was good. It's not that they don't have any brains, it's that their trying to coordinate with another force at 2-4 weeks distance. Historically it went like this: Jacks at Edinburgh; French hear Jacks might be at Edinburgh; Jacks at Derby; Jacks turn around; French surprised to hear Jacks at Derby; French prepare; French too late; French hear Jacks have run away; French disgusted & overrun Low Countries; Jacks defeated at Culloden. 5) Where did you see the +2 modifier? 6) Typo: bottom line should read "-1 west SCOTLAND" 7) I feel the delays are roughly historical based upon the information I have. Check my historical notes (especially the timeline) and the bibliography for a full answer. Two examples: Charlie's ship left the Loire on July 3rd and did not arrive at Lochnamuamh until the 25th. And his ship was already victualled and only had to rendezvous with a single escort, and the weater was decent. The French began loading on the 7th of December and Richelieu did notarrive to take command until the 17th. 8) "FPts" = Flemish Ports. Roll on the same when returning troops. Re the mechanics, what's giving you trouble? 9) Commanders are technically reassigned each turn for purposes of paying orders, checking initative, etc. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ian weir - 04:49pm Aug 6, 2002 PST (#225 of 244) Mad is he? Then I hope he will bite some of my other generals - King George II on James Wolfe John. Re the Siege: correct. It's not what I said, but it is the intent. How would you like to write rules for me? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ian weir - 05:17pm Aug 6, 2002 PST (#226 of 244) Mad is he? Then I hope he will bite some of my other generals - King George II on James Wolfe Adam. Re recruiting/activation you are correct. Re George & Guards you are correct. I'm going to amend the rules on George's release and transfer as follows: he is released in conjunction with the Flanders contingent. Prior to that event he can still act as CW in the Flanders Box. As for his arrival, the naval transfer is the only option available. His guard must escort him and do count for VPs. Re Naval: correct again. The text conflict is yet another typo. I see now the confusion over the "FPorts". Yes this is the Flemish Ports Sea Zone (emphasis on the Sea Zone). It didn't fit the chart so I made a contraction. Now it looks like a port reference. Anything else confusing in this area? Re last point it looks like you have found a bonafide loophole. The quick answer is to strike that particular choice (point #1 17.332) entirely. It could also be qualified by a release requirement. I favour striking it out, as it is quite a powerful tool, come to think of it. Keep the remaining points, but the contingent has to be released before the choice can be made. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Adam Starkweather - 06:06pm Aug 6, 2002 PST (#227 of 244) On the drawing board - It Never Snows in September. On the table - Highway to the Kremlin and PBEMing Thunder at the Crossroads. How would you like to write rules for me? Funny you should mention it - check your email tonight. :) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- John Kollar - 09:23pm Aug 6, 2002 PST (#228 of 244) Ian- A5) You're right, it would be helpful if I told you where to find it. The Jacobites have a +2 modifier for the Channel zone under the Sea Orders modifications (21.2). But there is no modifier under the Naval Interception Table. A8) I guess I would just like a comprehensive and detailed example. My problems start with Rule 18.24, the "Transit Table" the talk about cross-indexing the size of the group with the table, but the transit table has no cross-reference with the size of the group (the naval interception table does). Also, the third bulletpoint notes that "cross-index the size of the group with the sea zone the group is in at the time of rolling", but in the example, 18.284 the example uses the the sea zone the group is moving toward to use on the table. From reading everything again, I would assume that the example is incorrect, and to use the area the group is in, except if the group is in a port; then use the zone the group is moving into. -John PS: anyone shown any interest in doing an ADC2 set? :-) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ian weir - 11:13pm Aug 6, 2002 PST (#229 of 244) Mad is he? Then I hope he will bite some of my other generals - King George II on James Wolfe John. a) The sea zone orders mods originated with the nature of the zone (eg. strong tides and odd winds). The intercept mods were focused more on the positioning of the naval forces. So there isn't a discrepancy in the theory. However, I would suggest only using the weather modifiers for sea orders, as the zone mods are excessive. b) re a naval example. Yes it really is a mess. I'll need a few days. Look for a new errata update by the end of the weekend. It should include all the points covered today and a naval example (he said hopefully).